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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Mark ()
Date: September 11, 2011 07:01AM

Of all the hundreds of arguments and debates I've had over 9/11,it still never ceases to amaze me, that you can show someone video footage of WTC building 7 coming down and they still think that nothing is out of the ordinary.

A 47 storey building dismembers itself, breaking every nut, bolt, weld, joint and concrete column, all on its own. It then collapses and falls straight down into its own basement, through itself, at virtually free fall speed.

An impossibility!

This is the equivalent of your skeleton shattering and all of your joints and muscles comming apart, all at the same time, all by themselves, and you end up on the floor in a heap.

Yet, these people will not accept the possibility of a controlled demolition and will go to great lengths to find any excuse as to why it couldn't be a controlled demolition, even to the extent of saying to me "the laws of physics don't matter".

What makes people refuse to confront the obvious, the truth or the facts?

I think it is because they are frightened. They are affraid of what it means to know the truth, of where it leads and the new reality which the truth will create for them.
The are not emotionally mature enough to cope with this new frightening reality and resposibility that the truth will bring them.
So, both emotionally and intellectually, they run away from it,deny it, pretend that it's not there and hope that it will all go away, naive to the fact that they have contributed to the consequences to the American people, from and by, the criminals who perpetrated this act.
When you realise that the criminals are your Government and its agencies ....
That is a very frightening reality indeed.

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: bugstomper ()
Date: September 11, 2011 11:27AM

Keep in mind that in 1946 a 'U.S. Army B-25 bomber' crashed into the Empire State Building and that, the '...majority of the plane hit the 79th floor, creating a hole in the building eighteen feet wide and twenty feet high. The plane's high-octane fuel exploded, hurtling flames down the side of the building and inside through hallways and stairwells all the way down to the 75th floor'. This however did NOT make the Empire State Building collapse. Also contrary to the first post, engineer or not, burning aircraft fuel does not melt steel, nor does it turn concrete into dust, nor does it leave pools of molten metal at the bottom after the WTC buildings collapsed. Also, building 7, the CIA building, collapsed the same way, and that was never hit by any aircraft. In fact, I'll go as far to say, it was a false flag operation, of which only now, 'loose ends' have been tied up with the killing of Osama Bin Laden.

[history1900s.about.com]

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Hans Gruber ()
Date: September 11, 2011 10:04PM

Even thou the WTC fire was a fuel-rich, diffuse flame as evidenced by the copious black smoke. Factors such as flame volume and quantity of soot decrease the radiative heat loss in the fire, moving the temperature closer to the maximum of 1,000°C. However, it is highly unlikely that the steel at the WTC experienced temperatures above the 750–800°C range but even assuming normal residential fire temperature of 500°C to 650°C range is known that structural steel begins to soften around 425°C and loses about half of its strength at 650°C. But even a 50% loss of strength is still insufficient, by itself, to explain the WTC collapse. However, by taking into account the blast kinetic energy and explosion of the fuel and its destruction of so many member of the perimeter tube design of the WTC,even thought it was a highly redundantly designed. The loss of so many exterior columns due to aircraft impact,blast induced aluminum burning and fragmentation,plus the weakening of the steel, induced serious steel fracture and distortion. The temperature of the fire was not uniform everywhere, and the temperature on the outside of the box columns was clearly lower than on the side facing the fire. The temperature along the 18 m long joists was certainly not uniform. Given the thermal expansion of steel, a 150°C temperature difference from one location to another will produce yield-level residual stresses.and further decreased the perimeter tube structure count. The WTC, on this low-wind day, was likely not stressed no more than a third of the design allowable, which is roughly one-fifth of the yield strength of the steel.
All these factors combined produced distortions in the slender structural steel, which resulted in buckling failures not only of the perimeter tube structure but in the angle clips that held the floor joists between the columns on the perimeter wall and the core structure.As the joists on one or two of the most heavily burned floors gave way and the outer box columns began to bow outward, the floors above them also fell. The floor below (with its 1,300 t design capacity) could not support the roughly 45,000 t of ten floors (or more) above crashing down on these angle clips. This started the domino effect that caused the buildings to collapse within ten seconds, hitting bottom with an estimated speed of 200 km per hour.Thus, the failure of the steel was due to two factors: loss of strength due to the temperature of the fire, and loss of structural integrity due to distortion of the steel from the non-uniform temperatures in the fire. This event analysis of the catastrophe was verified by a 10m tall replica of the tower and an aluminum tube which was filled with jet fuel and impacted upon the replica. The results were as above- total structure failure. Most Skyscrapers are only designed to remain structurally sound with a unsuppressed fire for only 3 hours.

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Hans Gruber ()
Date: September 11, 2011 10:05PM

The WTC fire was a fuel-rich, diffuse flame as evidenced by the copious black smoke. Factors such as flame volume and quantity of soot decrease the radiative heat loss in the fire, moving the temperature closer to the maximum of 1,000°C. However, it is highly unlikely that the steel at the WTC experienced temperatures above the 750–800°C range but even assuming normal residential fire temperature of 500°C to 650°C range is known that structural steel begins to soften around 425°C and loses about half of its strength at 650°C. But even a 50% loss of strength is still insufficient, by itself, to explain the WTC collapse. However, by taking into account the blast kinetic energy and explosion of the fuel and its destruction of so many member of the perimeter tube design of the WTC,even thought it was a highly redundantly designed. The loss of so many exterior columns due to aircraft impact,blast induced aluminum burning and fragmentation,plus the weakening of the steel, induced serious steel fracture and distortion. The temperature of the fire was not uniform everywhere, and the temperature on the outside of the box columns was clearly lower than on the side facing the fire. The temperature along the 18 m long joists was certainly not uniform. Given the thermal expansion of steel, a 150°C temperature difference from one location to another will produce yield-level residual stresses.and further decreased the perimeter tube structure count. The WTC, on this low-wind day, was likely not stressed no more than a third of the design allowable, which is roughly one-fifth of the yield strength of the steel.
All these factors combined produced distortions in the slender structural steel, which resulted in buckling failures not only of the perimeter tube structure but in the angle clips that held the floor joists between the columns on the perimeter wall and the core structure.As the joists on one or two of the most heavily burned floors gave way and the outer box columns began to bow outward, the floors above them also fell. The floor below (with its 1,300 t design capacity) could not support the roughly 45,000 t of ten floors (or more) above crashing down on these angle clips. This started the domino effect that caused the buildings to collapse within ten seconds, hitting bottom with an estimated speed of 200 km per hour.Thus, the failure of the steel was due to two factors: loss of strength due to the temperature of the fire, and loss of structural integrity due to distortion of the steel from the non-uniform temperatures in the fire. This event of catastrophe was verified by a 10m tall replica of the tower and an aluminum tube which was filled with jet fuel and impacted upon the replica. The results were as above- total structure failure .

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Hans Gruber ()
Date: September 11, 2011 10:16PM

The Empire state building had a completely different designed.The towers were designed and built in the mid-1960s through the early 1970s. They represented a new approach to skyscrapers in that they were to be very lightweight and involved modular construction methods in order to accelerate the schedule and to reduce the costs. The Empire state building was designed with stone,steel and stone center core-big difference in design and why a plane did not bring it down. But, remember architects do not design building against plane strikes

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Shawn ()
Date: September 11, 2011 11:50PM

@ Chelsea

lose* ridiculous* awful*

Sorry, how is questioning a story full of more holes than a Golf course disrespectful?

How many people have died in the wars on WMDs/Terror, only made-possible by the 9/11 tragedy?

I want you to examine your post -- if we were theoretically correct in questioning the 'official' story (humor us), wouldn't your statement be the exact glue holding the 'official' story together? Don't use the dead as a scape-goat for your ignorance. Apply a scientific thought process to the story and start asking what DOESN'T make sense. You'll find with an open-mind, that the questions start piling up very quickly.

And why do you assault the people who question this (many of them relatives of the deceased), and defend the government's establishment of this veiled-slavery? Compare travelling, right to privacy, freedom of speech, pre and post 9/11. This attitude brings to mind the South Park quote, "If you don't like America, you can get-out". I have never once seen someone post anything negative about the innocent-lives lost; they are attacking your GOVERNMENT's story. Stop acting defensive and use some fucking logic.

Finally, Fox news -- now who's being disrespectful?

Love visiting, but proudly Canadian.

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: William Andrejko ()
Date: September 12, 2011 06:57AM

Dear Jane O, please don't confuse people who want to know the truth with people who "hate" their country. The official 911 report is full of holes that the government won't answer. Why? We just want the truth. I love this country when it does good things as I'm sure you do too.

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: SAYJUAN ()
Date: September 12, 2011 08:39PM

tHEIR WAS SUCH A PERSON WHO DID CONNECT THE DOTS AND SPOKE UP ABOUT THE WORLD TRADE CENTER ATTACK BEFORE IT EVEN HAPPENED JOHN ONIEL

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Tony ()
Date: September 13, 2011 03:12AM

LOL @Chelsea and Jane. This is why women don't make good politicians, (in fact the majority of them DON'T like politics.)

Jane, Chelsea, why do demolition experts have to plan for months and even a year at times to take down buildings that are nowhere near as tall as the WTC? And yet 2 airplanes striking different places caused the same free fall collapse?

You folks ARE being brainwashed by your media. For example, how is it when a third of you are either scrapping by on 2 to 3 jobs or unemployed, USA sends 5 billion to Israel each year, for a mere 5 million people? A billion bucks per million Jews!

Just go back to WW2 warner brother cartoons and the following decades, arabs were already being made to look evil. Then we have bugs bunny cross dressing, acting gay (already planting the seed in the minds of young children). Hollywood is just rife with liberal propaganda telling us marriage sucks, having kids is a pain, God is fake, etc etc etc. Now I don't know if its the same down in USA, but here in Canada, one would be hard pressed to go a few days without some kind of mention of Hitler and the Nazis, and the Jewish Holocaust either in the paper or on TV. Yet what about the 22 million Chinese who died who were wiped out by the Japanese, and ONLY!!! 56 of them were released upon Japan's defeat! I can for example be an Asian Holocaust denier and almost everyone wouldn't even know wtf I was talking about. Or what about all the people who had to live under Russian communism because the allies allowed them to conquer on the way the to Germany, it makes what the Jews went through look like paradise in comparison, but we can't have ANYONE thinking that now can we? Or what about more recent genocides like Rwanda, former Yugoslavia, Christians being killed in China etc etc. Your media is nothing but a propoganda machine.

Seriously? Why is USA ONLY going after Iraq, Afghanistan, and frothing at the mouth to go to war with Iran. Coincidentally all Israel's enemies. Anyone with a half a brains should be able to see whats going on here.

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Clay ()
Date: September 13, 2011 05:49AM

Well Mr. Bruce Williams You Say this.... No steel building other than the WTC has ever collapsed due to any fire of any sort.

Do your research a little better.

I am a firefighter and have been in a few major cities in Canada and have seen many steel buildings collapse due to fire.

That is the most retarded thing I have ever heard

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Jonny ()
Date: September 22, 2011 09:05PM

Just seen a youtube video.911 explosive evidence-experts speak out , basically over a thousand building and demolition experts say that fire could not have melted the steel and indeed their is a cover up!

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Coon ()
Date: October 04, 2011 11:50AM

Chelsea Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Really. How many people died on 9/11? And this is
> what you have to say? WOW....
> You know another popular conspiracy theory? That
> the real Paul Mccartney died in January of 1967
> and the Beatles replaced him with a look alike so
> they wouldn't loose their fame.... Now go off on
> this ridiculous piece of imformation you know
> nothing about. At least this time you wont be
> direspecting 3,000 people and their families.
> Stop being rediculous, 9/11 was aweful, some bad
> people got together(as bad poeple often do) and
> did a really really bad thing. Stop acting like
> the government is trying to kill everyone. My
> goodness, people get an internet connection and
> watch Fox News and suddenly they have it all
> figured out.


Dear Chelsea
This is not a discussion about emotion, go cry somewhere else. Also good people did die because they are paying a bad government, yes the USA has a lot of stuff that happens in the dark.

Young bright minds like above are getting to the truth and people like you just keep on saying: it was bad lets leave it and move on. But the true question is move on to what? move on until it happens again?

This will never blow over until there is an open discussion with the Gov of USA about plain simple facts ex( cut girders/i-beams, molten steel, explosions, fires burning greater than they should, flight paths, the erratic movement of the plane on course to the towers and so many more), and when the people stop giving in to weak excuses of answers from the gov and their so called investigations.

So Chelsea if you want to contribute to this thread/forum/discussion please stick to the topic which is: Could the steel in the WTC be weakened enough from the fire caused by that plane.

IMO
No, the top tilted (that i can see being caused by the plane) and suddenly the whole building imploded.... no it does not make any sense.

greetings
Electrical/Mechanical engineer

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Noah Hunter ()
Date: October 14, 2011 08:20AM

9/11 conspiracy nuts are also the ones that the planes cant be used to destroy a building. Yet none of them have come forward with true Physics to prove that it cant happen. But you know why its because it can happen. If thermite was used on the towers where is the byproducts of the burn. If you say they don't produce a byproduct you need to do some chemistry. Building 1,2 and 7 did not fall because of a controlled detonation. if you look at actual photos of the collapse of towers 1 & 2 you see the top floor falling on top of the next as well as the outer wall peeling away from the building. in a controlled detonation of a building that size they would have caused the building to fall in on itself not outward. Now on to building 7 the major one that the 9/11 conspiracy nuts say was brought down by a controlled detonation because a fire chief said pull it. In fire man lingo that means pull the teams back because its unsafe. Now for the collapse of the building what the 9/11 conspiracy nuts don't show you is the HIGHLY damaged side of building 7 that was facing the twin towers. IF you watch the fall of building 7 it fell it fell towards the damaged side. in order to tell me that it didn't happen the way it did you better have true scientific proof.

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: oliver ()
Date: October 15, 2011 06:30PM

@noah

forget it.. the people that believe the gov "detonated" the towers wont listen to facts...

im not sayin there is no conspiracy, but not to bring the towers down.

on the other hand, would 9/11 have happend if:

1.the us wouldnt piss-off half of the planet all the time

2.if bush and his advis. would have had a clue about whats "going on" in the world and pulled the plug on osama/alqaida BEFORE 9/11 happend?



we never went to iraq because of the towers. it was money and a pissed of dick C. who didnt get a deal back then )that another country got).

[en.wikipedia.org]

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Axe ()
Date: October 20, 2011 12:16PM

So if the Gov detonated the towers what are you going to do about it?

Jack Shit that's what, the conspiracy idiots are so blinded by their own stupidity that they are quite happy to sit here disputing the facts (and the science) and prattle on about how the Gov will kill it's voters for money and oil.

The facts speak for themselves the towers came down due to plane strikes nothing more,
And if the Gov were responsible, then just flying the planes into the buildings would have been enough to get public support for going after AlQ, therfore no need to make the towers fall.

I feel sorry for all Americans, the ones that are so stupid they think the Gov is trying to kill them (and they do nothing about it) and the others who must get so depressed that they come from the same country as these retards.

One thing I have really enjoyed about reading these comments though is that some of you think pools of molten steel were being found at the bottom of the WTCs. That's just priceless, with that level of intelegence I'm surprised you can work your TV remote, never mind the internet.

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Somebody ()
Date: October 20, 2011 06:52PM

To all the conspiracy theorists:
A residential fire is able to produce temperatures in the range of 500-650 C (according to Hans above...)
A residential fire is not helped along by jet fuel or massive kinetic events like an AIRLINER CRASHING INTO IT AT 440 OR 540 MPH, nor is it anywhere NEAR as large.

Aluminum melts at 660 C.
Molten aluminum + IRON OXIDE = Thermite.
Aluminum supplied by the AIRCRAFT.
Iron oxide supplied by the BUILDING.

A thermite reaction produces temperatures OVER 3000 C, far greater than what is required to MELT it.

As far as the building collapsing after the beams melted... well gee, what do you THINK will happen? You set your hammer on top of your nail and think that gravity will cause the hammer to press the nail into the board? No, but if you take a WHACK at it, it will drive in with a couple or three hits. THIS WAS NO HAMMER, it was THIRTY FLOORS OF A BUILDING!!!!

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Scott Benedict ()
Date: October 24, 2011 02:05AM

Unfortunately for the naysayers, there’s really no debate. You’ve had the wool pulled over your eyes for years. Check out the following videos showing that:

1 Building number 7 was never hit by an airplane. This video shows evidence of a controlled demolition. Search YouTube for: “4409 -- (Unseen Footage) Tower 7 blasted into rubble from NEW angle!” or copy and paste the following URL into your address bar: [www.youtube.com]

2 The temperature of burning jet fuel & office furniture burns at a maximum of 1,472 degrees. Steel begins to melt at 2,795 degrees. No buildings (except those at WTC) have ever fallen from fire. Military grade Nanothermite explosives both exploded and unexploded (produced only at Indian Head Naval Warfare Station in Maryland and Los Alamos National laboratory in New Mexico) were found in the ruble of the WTC: [www.youtube.com]

3 Tons of molten steel were found six weeks after 9/11. According to experts, jet fuel would have burned off within the first 15 minutes. The temperature of the molten steel exceeded the maximum temperature of burning jet fuel - six weeks after the collapse of the towers: [www.youtube.com]


But all this doesn’t make sense unless you understand the bigger picture… Have you heard of the Illuminati and their plans for a New World Order? President H.W. Bush spoke publicly about it on national television. The Illuminati compose 1% of the world's population, but control the "masses" from the top down. That's over 3,000,000 + people who are sworn to secrecy in this country alone and threatened with their lives if they talk. They are raised from birth in Illuminati households and attend secret meetings. They are fed vastly different information than the information you and I have received in the U.S.-Illuminati-controlled public school system. They own all the media, which is why you've probably never heard about any of this. Their bloodlines have been passed down secretly for thousands of years - since ancient Egypt (thus the pyramid symbol). They only let pro-Hitler-type people filter up to the top. That is why so many people could have been involved and the masses would never know. Check these videos regarding the bigger picture:

1 Oh… And here’s one about the New World Order that plans to kill 90% of the world’s population. Good luck arguing with me on this topic after that! Search YouTube for: “The Secret Government, The skinny on the planned cashless society” [www.brasschecktv.com]

2 Search YouTube for: "Rare interview with Svali, an Illuminati defector, Part 1" found at: [www.youtube.com]

3 Search YouTube for: “The 9 11 Files The CIA's Visas for Terrorists Program.flv”
[www.brasschecktv.com]

4 Marvin Bush, the president’s younger brother, directed SecureCom, the security company in charge of the WTC. The weekend before the attack, there was an unprecedented power-down in the building. All security doors were unlocked, allowing strange workmen into the building. Bomb-sniffing dogs were removed. Search YouTube for: “Power Downs, Evacuations, Strange Events in Weeks Before 9/11” [www.youtube.com]

5 Search You Tube for: “CIA And Pentagon Asset Anwar Al Awlaki Dined At Pentagon Months After 9/11”
[www.youtube.com]

6 FBI insider, top veteran, and whistleblower, Ted Gunderson, says FBI helped plant bombs in 1993. He says that President George W. Bush “must have known.” Search YouTube for: “The Real Meaning of Terrorism”
[www.brasschecktv.com]

7 Search You Tube for: “The Bush - Nazi Connection”:
[www.brasschecktv.com]

8 Search You Tube for: “Computerized election fraud”:
[www.brasschecktv.com]

9 How about the 300 most powerful and secretive people in the world that really run things? Search You Tube for: “1/10 The Committee of 300 Conspirators' Hierarchy: Dr. John Coleman” [www.youtube.com]


I have more links if anyone still needs more convincing…

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Scott Benedict ()
Date: October 24, 2011 02:08AM

Testing

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Dave ()
Date: October 24, 2011 02:21AM

Unfortunately for the naysayers, there’s really no debate. You’ve had the wool pulled over your eyes for years. Check out the following videos showing that:

1 Building number 7 was never hit by an airplane. This video shows evidence of a controlled demolition. Search YouTube for: “4409 -- (Unseen Footage) Tower 7 blasted into rubble from NEW angle!” or copy and paste the following URL into your address bar: [www.youtube.com]

2 The temperature of burning jet fuel & office furniture burns at a maximum of 1,472 degrees. Steel begins to melt at 2,795 degrees. No buildings (except those at WTC) have ever fallen from fire. Military grade Nanothermite explosives both exploded and unexploded (produced only at Indian Head Naval Warfare Station in Maryland and Los Alamos National laboratory in New Mexico) were found in the ruble of the WTC: [www.youtube.com]

3 Tons of molten steel were found six weeks after 9/11. According to experts, jet fuel would have burned off within the first 15 minutes. The temperature of the molten steel exceeded the maximum temperature of burning jet fuel - six weeks after the collapse of the towers: [www.youtube.com]

But all this doesn’t make sense unless you understand the bigger picture… Have you heard of the Illuminati and their plans for a New World Order? President H.W. Bush spoke publicly about it on national television. The Illuminati compose 1% of the world's population, but control the "masses" from the top down. That's over 3,000,000 + people who are sworn to secrecy in this country alone and threatened with their lives if they talk. They are raised from birth in Illuminati households and attend secret meetings. They are fed vastly different information than the information you and I have received in the U.S.-Illuminati-controlled public school system. They own all the media, which is why you've probably never heard about any of this. Their bloodlines have been passed down secretly for thousands of years - since ancient Egypt (thus the pyramid symbol). They only let pro-Hitler-type people filter up to the top. That is why so many people could have been involved and the masses would never know. Check these videos regarding the bigger picture:

1 Oh… And here’s one about the New World Order that plans to kill 90% of the world’s population. Good luck arguing with me on this topic after that! Search YouTube for: “The Secret Government, The skinny on the planned cashless society” [www.brasschecktv.com]

2 Search YouTube for: "Rare interview with Svali, an Illuminati defector, Part 1" found at: [www.youtube.com]

3 Search YouTube for: “The 9 11 Files The CIA's Visas for Terrorists Program.flv”
[www.brasschecktv.com]

4 Marvin Bush, the president’s younger brother, directed SecureCom, the security company in charge of the WTC. The weekend before the attack, there was an unprecedented power-down in the building. All security doors were unlocked, allowing strange workmen into the building. Bomb-sniffing dogs were removed. Search YouTube for: “Power Downs, Evacuations, Strange Events in Weeks Before 9/11” [www.youtube.com]

5 Search You Tube for: “CIA And Pentagon Asset Anwar Al Awlaki Dined At Pentagon Months After 9/11”
[www.youtube.com]

6 FBI insider, top veteran, and whistleblower, Ted Gunderson, says FBI helped plant bombs in 1993. He says that President George W. Bush “must have known.” Search YouTube for: “The Real Meaning of Terrorism”
[www.brasschecktv.com]

7 Search You Tube for: “The Bush - Nazi Connection”:
[www.brasschecktv.com]

8 Search You Tube for: “Computerized election fraud”:
[www.brasschecktv.com]

9 How about the 300 most powerful and secretive people in the world that really run things? Search You Tube for: “1/10 The Committee of 300 Conspirators' Hierarchy: Dr. John Coleman” [www.youtube.com]

I have more links if anyone still needs more convincing…

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Dave ()
Date: October 24, 2011 02:23AM

Unfortunately for the naysayers, there’s really no debate. You’ve had the wool pulled over your eyes for years. Check out the following videos showing that:

1 Building number 7 was never hit by an airplane. This video shows evidence of a controlled demolition. Search YouTube for: “4409 -- (Unseen Footage) Tower 7 blasted into rubble from NEW angle!” or copy and paste the following URL into your address bar: [www.youtube.com]

2 The temperature of burning jet fuel & office furniture burns at a maximum of 1,472 degrees. Steel begins to melt at 2,795 degrees. No buildings (except those at WTC) have ever fallen from fire. Military grade Nanothermite explosives both exploded and unexploded (produced only at Indian Head Naval Warfare Station in Maryland and Los Alamos National laboratory in New Mexico) were found in the ruble of the WTC: [www.youtube.com]

3 Tons of molten steel were found six weeks after 9/11. According to experts, jet fuel would have burned off within the first 15 minutes. The temperature of the molten steel exceeded the maximum temperature of burning jet fuel - six weeks after the collapse of the towers: [www.youtube.com]

But all this doesn’t make sense unless you understand the bigger picture… Have you heard of the Illuminati and their plans for a New World Order? President H.W. Bush spoke publicly about it on national television. The Illuminati compose 1% of the world's population, but control the "masses" from the top down. That's over 3,000,000 + people who are sworn to secrecy in this country alone and threatened with their lives if they talk. They are raised from birth in Illuminati households and attend secret meetings. They are fed vastly different information than the information you and I have received in the U.S.-Illuminati-controlled public school system. They own all the media, which is why you've probably never heard about any of this. Their bloodlines have been passed down secretly for thousands of years - since ancient Egypt (thus the pyramid symbol). They only let pro-Hitler-type people filter up to the top. That is why so many people could have been involved and the masses would never know. Check these videos regarding the bigger picture:

1 Oh… And here’s one about the New World Order that plans to kill 90% of the world’s population. Good luck arguing with me on this topic after that! Search YouTube for: “The Secret Government, The skinny on the planned cashless society” [www.brasschecktv.com]

2 Search YouTube for: "Rare interview with Svali, an Illuminati defector, Part 1" found at: [www.youtube.com]

3 Search YouTube for: “The 9 11 Files The CIA's Visas for Terrorists Program.flv”
[www.brasschecktv.com]

4 Marvin Bush, the president’s younger brother, directed SecureCom, the security company in charge of the WTC. The weekend before the attack, there was an unprecedented power-down in the building. All security doors were unlocked, allowing strange workmen into the building. Bomb-sniffing dogs were removed. Search YouTube for: “Power Downs, Evacuations, Strange Events in Weeks Before 9/11” [www.youtube.com]

5 Search You Tube for: “CIA And Pentagon Asset Anwar Al Awlaki Dined At Pentagon Months After 9/11”
[www.youtube.com]

6 FBI insider, top veteran, and whistleblower, Ted Gunderson, says FBI helped plant bombs in 1993. He says that President George W. Bush “must have known.” Search YouTube for: “The Real Meaning of Terrorism”
[www.brasschecktv.com]

7 Search You Tube for: “The Bush - Nazi Connection”:
[www.brasschecktv.com]

8 Search You Tube for: “Computerized election fraud”:
[www.brasschecktv.com]

9 How about the 300 most powerful and secretive people in the world that really run things? Search You Tube for: “1/10 The Committee of 300 Conspirators' Hierarchy: Dr. John Coleman” [www.youtube.com]

I have more links if anyone still needs more convincing…

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Dave ()
Date: October 24, 2011 02:24AM

Unfortunately for the naysayers, there’s really no debate. You’ve had the wool pulled over your eyes for years. Check out the following videos showing that:

1 Building number 7 was never hit by an airplane. This video shows evidence of a controlled demolition. Search YouTube for: “4409 -- (Unseen Footage) Tower 7 blasted into rubble from NEW angle!” or copy and paste the following URL into your address bar: [www.youtube.com]
2 The temperature of burning jet fuel & office furniture burns at a maximum of 1,472 degrees. Steel begins to melt at 2,795 degrees. No buildings (except those at WTC) have ever fallen from fire. Military grade Nanothermite explosives both exploded and unexploded (produced only at Indian Head Naval Warfare Station in Maryland and Los Alamos National laboratory in New Mexico) were found in the ruble of the WTC: [www.youtube.com]
3 Tons of molten steel were found six weeks after 9/11. According to experts, jet fuel would have burned off within the first 15 minutes. The temperature of the molten steel exceeded the maximum temperature of burning jet fuel - six weeks after the collapse of the towers: [www.youtube.com]


But all this doesn’t make sense unless you understand the bigger picture… Have you heard of the Illuminati and their plans for a New World Order? President H.W. Bush spoke publicly about it on national television. The Illuminati compose 1% of the world's population, but control the "masses" from the top down. That's over 3,000,000 + people who are sworn to secrecy in this country alone and threatened with their lives if they talk. They are raised from birth in Illuminati households and attend secret meetings. They are fed vastly different information than the information you and I have received in the U.S.-Illuminati-controlled public school system. They own all the media, which is why you've probably never heard about any of this. Their bloodlines have been passed down secretly for thousands of years - since ancient Egypt (thus the pyramid symbol). They only let pro-Hitler-type people filter up to the top. That is why so many people could have been involved and the masses would never know. Check these videos regarding the bigger picture:

1 Oh… And here’s one about the New World Order that plans to kill 90% of the world’s population. Good luck arguing with me on this topic after that! Search YouTube for: “The Secret Government, The skinny on the planned cashless society” [www.brasschecktv.com]
2 Search YouTube for: "Rare interview with Svali, an Illuminati defector, Part 1" found at: [www.youtube.com]

3 Search YouTube for: “The 9 11 Files The CIA's Visas for Terrorists Program.flv”
[www.brasschecktv.com]

4 Marvin Bush, the president’s younger brother, directed SecureCom, the security company in charge of the WTC. The weekend before the attack, there was an unprecedented power-down in the building. All security doors were unlocked, allowing strange workmen into the building. Bomb-sniffing dogs were removed. Search YouTube for: “Power Downs, Evacuations, Strange Events in Weeks Before 9/11” [www.youtube.com]

5 Search You Tube for: “CIA And Pentagon Asset Anwar Al Awlaki Dined At Pentagon Months After 9/11”
[www.youtube.com]

6 FBI insider, top veteran, and whistleblower, Ted Gunderson, says FBI helped plant bombs in 1993. He says that President George W. Bush “must have known.” Search YouTube for: “The Real Meaning of Terrorism”
[www.brasschecktv.com]

7 Search You Tube for: “The Bush - Nazi Connection”:
[www.brasschecktv.com]

8 Search You Tube for: “Computerized election fraud”:
[www.brasschecktv.com]

9 How about the 300 most powerful and secretive people in the world that really run things? Search You Tube for: “1/10 The Committee of 300 Conspirators' Hierarchy: Dr. John Coleman” [www.youtube.com]


I have more links if anyone still needs more convincing…

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Dave ()
Date: October 24, 2011 03:16AM

Unfortunately for the naysayers, there’s really no debate. You’ve had the wool pulled over your eyes for years. Check out the following videos showing that:

1 Building number 7 was never hit by an airplane. This video shows evidence of a controlled demolition. Search YouTube for: “4409 -- (Unseen Footage) Tower 7 blasted into rubble from NEW angle!”

2 The temperature of burning jet fuel & office furniture burns at a maximum of 1,472 degrees. Steel begins to melt at 2,795 degrees. No buildings (except those at WTC) have ever fallen from fire. Military grade Nanothermite explosives both exploded and unexploded (produced only at Indian Head Naval Warfare Station in Maryland and Los Alamos National laboratory in New Mexico) were found in the ruble of the WTC. URL: [911caper.com]

3 Tons of molten steel were found six weeks after 9/11. According to experts, jet fuel would have burned off within the first 15 minutes. The temperature of the molten steel exceeded the maximum temperature of burning jet fuel - six weeks after the collapse of the towers. Search YouTube for: “9/11 Inside Job - The Most Damning Evidence Yet!”

But all this doesn’t make sense unless you understand the bigger picture… Have you heard of the Illuminati and their plans for a New World Order? President H.W. Bush spoke publicly about it on national television. The Illuminati compose 1% of the world's population, but control the "masses" from the top down. That's over 3,000,000 + people who are sworn to secrecy in this country alone and threatened with their lives if they talk. They are raised from birth in Illuminati households and attend secret meetings. They are fed vastly different information than the information you and I have received in the U.S.-Illuminati-controlled public school system. They own all the media, which is why you've probably never heard about any of this. Their bloodlines have been passed down secretly for thousands of years - since ancient Egypt (thus the pyramid symbol). They only let pro-Hitler-type people filter up to the top. That is why so many people could have been involved and the masses would never know. Check these videos regarding the bigger picture:

1 Search YouTube for: “The Secret Government, The skinny on the planned cashless society”

2 Search YouTube for: "Rare interview with Svali, an Illuminati defector, Part 1"

3 Search YouTube for: “The 9 11 Files The CIA's Visas for Terrorists Program.flv”

4 Marvin Bush, the president’s younger brother, directed SecureCom, the security company in charge of the WTC. The weekend before the attack, there was an unprecedented power-down in the building. All security doors were unlocked, allowing strange workmen into the building. Bomb-sniffing dogs were removed. Search YouTube for: “Power Downs, Evacuations, Strange Events in Weeks Before 9/11”

5 Search You Tube for: “CIA And Pentagon Asset Anwar Al Awlaki Dined At Pentagon Months After 9/11”

6 FBI insider, top veteran, and whistleblower, Ted Gunderson, says FBI helped plant bombs in 1993. He says that President George W. Bush “must have known.” Search YouTube for: “The Real Meaning of Terrorism”

7 Search You Tube for: “The Bush - Nazi Connection"

8 Search You Tube for: “Computerized election fraud"

9 How about the 300 most powerful and secretive people in the world that really run things? Search You Tube for: “1/10 The Committee of 300 Conspirators' Hierarchy: Dr. John Coleman”

I have more links if anyone still needs more convincing…

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Dave ()
Date: October 24, 2011 03:24AM

Unfortunately for the naysayers, there’s really no debate. You’ve had the wool pulled over your eyes for years. Check out the following videos showing that:

1 Building number 7 was never hit by an airplane. This video shows evidence of a controlled demolition. Search YouTube for: “4409 -- (Unseen Footage) Tower 7 blasted into rubble from NEW angle!”

2 The temperature of burning jet fuel & office furniture burns at a maximum of 1,472 degrees. Steel begins to melt at 2,795 degrees. No buildings (except those at WTC) have ever fallen from fire. Military grade Nanothermite explosives both exploded and unexploded (produced only at Indian Head Naval Warfare Station in Maryland and Los Alamos National laboratory in New Mexico) were found in the ruble of the WTC. URL: [911caper.com]

3 Tons of molten steel were found six weeks after 9/11. According to experts, jet fuel would have burned off within the first 15 minutes. The temperature of the molten steel exceeded the maximum temperature of burning jet fuel - six weeks after the collapse of the towers. Search YouTube for: “9/11 Inside Job - The Most Damning Evidence Yet!”

But all this doesn’t make sense unless you understand the bigger picture… Have you heard of the Illuminati and their plans for a New World Order? President H.W. Bush spoke publicly about it on national television. The Illuminati compose 1% of the world's population, but control the "masses" from the top down. That's over 3,000,000 + people who are sworn to secrecy in this country alone and threatened with their lives if they talk. They are raised from birth in Illuminati households and attend secret meetings. They are fed vastly different information than the information you and I have received in the U.S.-Illuminati-controlled public school system. They own all the media, which is why you've probably never heard about any of this. Their bloodlines have been passed down secretly for thousands of years - since ancient Egypt (thus the pyramid symbol). They only let pro-Hitler-type people filter up to the top. That is why so many people could have been involved and the masses would never know. Check these videos regarding the bigger picture:

1 Search YouTube for: “The Secret Government, The skinny on the planned cashless society”

2 Search YouTube for: "Rare interview with Svali, an Illuminati defector, Part 1"

3 Search YouTube for: “The 9 11 Files The CIA's Visas for Terrorists Program.flv”

4 Search YouTube for: “Power Downs, Evacuations, Strange Events in Weeks Before 9/11” Marvin Bush, the president’s younger brother, directed the security company in charge of the WTC. The weekend before the attack, there was an unprecedented power-down in the building. All security doors were unlocked, allowing strange workmen into the building. Bomb-sniffing dogs were removed.

5 Search You Tube for: “CIA And Pentagon Asset Anwar Al Awlaki Dined At Pentagon Months After 9/11”

6 FBI insider, top veteran, and whistleblower, Ted Gunderson, says FBI helped plant bombs in 1993. He says that President George W. Bush “must have known.” Search YouTube for: “The Real Meaning of Terrorism”

7 Search You Tube for: “The Bush - Nazi Connection”:

8 Search You Tube for: “Computerized election fraud”:

9 Search You Tube for: “1/10 The Committee of 300 Conspirators' Hierarchy: Dr. John Coleman” for information about the 300 most powerful and secretive men in the world who really run things.

I have more links if anyone needs more convincing…

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Dima ()
Date: November 01, 2011 06:12AM

Mr. Gord, there is nothing scientific in conspiracy theorists' explanations. Pseudoscience is not science. If you don't have enough brains or education to distinguish between the two you really should be quiet because you do look like a retard who's trying to look smart. Logic is only good if it works with sound assumptions and data, which conspiracy theories failed to provide. Garbage in--garbage out can look perfectly logical but it's garbage nonetheless. I found it generally a waste of time trying to explain to an ignorant person something as complicated as a plane crashing into a building. Conspiracy theorists know well the average joe will not investigate (nor does he have the brains to analyze) the assumptions made,it's too confusing, but he will readily fall for "evil government" nonsense because it goes well with an individual's paranoia and feeling of detachment from power.
Whenever I engage in a discussion about 911 and present scientific evidence, after a few posts I'm accused of "narrow-mindedness", being "brainwashed" etc.--such accusations are a clear sign of lack of constructive arguments. It's usually the ignorant side that uses this accusation. For example, it doesn't compute in their heads that a 363m freefall will take 8.61s--but the North Tower fell for about 15s, as confirmed by videos. Or that a 767 at 51% load weighs 130889kg and an impact at 748km/h will instantly release 2.825 billion Joules of energy-- equal to detonating 615.5kg (1356lb) of TNT--that energy will be released at points of most resistance--the steel structural beams. Add to that the energy of the fireball and we'll see how many beams survive. Remaining structural elements get overloaded, and considering the design of WTC they were. They become much easier to break with or without heat, especially because not all remaining ones carry the overload evenly. Then one fails and it's a chain reaction. So on and so forth. Maybe I'm narrow-minded, but at least my narrow-mindedness is explained by very clear limits of science and evidence. Your view is a paranoid pseudoscientific garbage hypothesis.

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: TheUknown ()
Date: November 02, 2011 06:39PM

one thing i do know is that an office fire wont bring down a building..next thing i know is that News agencies, politicians and others call ppl in the middle east terrorists..but if i do recall up to a day like today not one single nulcear war head or long range bombs has been found in Iraq..and well America still went into Iraq anyway and bombed them..the evidence given to support the idea that Iraq was mobilising wasnt accurate..so if the american government cud fabricate such then what cud they possibly not do..my opinion whether u agree or not

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: Jonathan ()
Date: November 06, 2011 11:14AM

Let me just say that I know absolutely nothing about steel structures, kerosene/jet fuel and the consistencies they share, and I may not even have all of the facts, but that's ok. I'm just a common guy (like millions of others) that can tell truth from lies based on simple common sense. It doesn't take a building engineer, a chemist, or an expert on anything involved in the 9/11 attacks to see that something is definitely wrong with the WHOLE 9/11 "terrorist" attacks. The Pentagon, by far, is the easiest building to prove that no plane hit the building. The hole in the Pentagon is roughly 65ft wide, and 73ft tall. A Boeing 757 airliner (the same jet that allegedly "Hit" the Pentagon) is 124ft wide (wing tip to wing tip), 155ft long, and 44ft tall. HOW can a plane with a wingspan of 124 feet make a hole only 65 feet wide? PLUS with the 8,600 gallons of fuel it was carrying, why wasn't there more fire damage? Why did the damage not look anything like the WTC towers? Why is there hardly any smoke/fire damage? Why did the FBI confiscate all videos of the plane entering the Pentagon for National Security? If a plane really DIDN'T hit the Pentagon, What did? And where did that Boeing 757 go to with the flight crew and all the innocent passengers? Just by looking at the simple math of the size of that Boeing 757 and the size of the hole in the Pentagon, its evident that a cover up story was fed to the public, and we swallowed it. Whole. I just find it hard to believe that 2 Airliners can have enough fuel in them to take down 2 of the worlds largest steel structured buildings. Actually, its absurd. Look at the size of one of the planes, and then look at the size of each of the Twin Towers. Those planes are like 1/8th the size of the towers. And how much of each one of those planes did the Jet Fuel take up? Maybe 1/4th of the plane? Maybe 1/3rd? Those 2 towers were made to resist earthquakes, hurricanes, you name it, mostly because of the redundant steel structure they were made from; if one steel beam weakened, the weight would shift to all of the other steel beams, leaving the building standing still. Those 2 towers were under enormous amounts of wind pressure, every single day. IF the jet fuel was really able so sink all the way down through 4' concrete covered steel, to the very bottom floor and weaken the steel structures, wouldn't the wind pressure going up against the buildings (that is at LEAST 3 times greater than the plane hitting) make the two towers fall un-evenly? Not straight down? Why is it that the only 3 steel towers that have ever fallen from planes crashing into them are the WTC North and South towers, and Building #7? From 2 planes 3 buildings fell, huh? If you told anyone that prior to 9/11 no one would believe you. But all of a sudden, trauma blinds us to what is really going on. Totally unbelievable situations happen and we choose to believe them because our Government tells us to. Why? Don't get me wrong, I still feel sick watching those people die and all the families hurting, I can't even imagine what they still go through. But I refuse to let trauma and emotion blind my common sense. Maybe the Twin Towers did fall from Jet Fuel. Who knows, right? All I know is that the Pentagon is totally unbelievable, and if ANYTHING is unbelievable in the 9/11 Attacks, why should we believe any of it? If you found out that someone was telling you 70% of the truth, and the rest of the 30% were lies, would you believe them if they told you something else? If you knew they lied 30% of the time? I know i couldn't. I wouldn't even be able to believe anything else they said, even if it was Truth.



This is going to sound extremely disturbing, but I believe that the 9/11 attacks were planned. The guy who owned the WTC towers bought Terrorist insurance on the buildings right before they fell. Coincidence? Everything was planned. In 12 hours we went from not worrying about terrorists, to hating Muslims - the same Muslims who's religion won't allow them to be involved in a 1 World Government with other faiths. After 9/11, we started planting bases in a lot of terrorist countries. Everyone was for it, to "get rid of terrorism"! But what if our own government was the mastermind behind that awful tragedy? What if they just played on our emotions in order for us to support putting bases in other countries? What about that Underwear Bomber of Detroit? He's from Yemen. Why do we have a base in Yemen now?? Oh yeah, cause we've maybe had a couple tiny threats in the past 50 years, but who cares! While the government whispers in your ear "Down with Terrorism! The ones who killed our innocent families!". SO now the U.S. has bases in a ton of different countries who's religion's won't allow a one world operating government. Ironic? I think not. Now when the whole One World Government breaks out, the grand ol' USA already has bases in all the rebel countries who will try to fight back! But they will have alot of trouble, because the Citizens of the U.S. have allowed their minds to be tricked and their emotions to be played on (BY THEIR OWN GOVERNMENT, who now has bases to either hold captive rebel countries, or to destroy them!) The no GOLD situation goes hand in hand with this idea also. I know I sound absolutely crazy, but if you give this whole idea thing a thought or two, you might see where I'm comin' from.

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: c.i.a.isthebadguys ()
Date: December 24, 2011 04:35PM

YOU IMAGINE THE PRESIDENT TELLING THEM TO DESTROY THE WORLD TRADE CENTERS? WELL THATS EXACTLY WHAT HAPPENED. LOOK INTO THE BUSH FAMILY HISTORY. U LOOK INTO HOW BUSH GOT INTO THE FLIGHT ACADEMY IN TEXAS WHEN HE SCORED SOO LOW HE BARELY QUALIFIESD TO DRIVE A BUS. LOOK INTO HOW HE STOLE THE ELECTION ILLEGALLY WHEN HE HAD HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF BLACK VOTES THROWN OUT IN FLORIDA IN THE 2000 ELECTION.LOOK HOW HE SAID IRAQ HAS WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION AND THEY CLEARLY DID NOT WHEN WE GOT THERE AND TOOK OVER. LOOK INTO BUSH SENIORS INVOLEMENT IN THE C.I.A. AND THE WRONGFUL INVASION OF PANAMA. LOOK INTO THE JFK ASSASSINATION FIND OUT WHY MANY PEOPLE BELIEVE BUSH WAS INVOLVED ON SETTING HIM UP.THE BUSH FAMILY ARE GERMAN NAZI DESCENDANTS. LOOK UP GRANDADY BUSH VANAVAR BUSH.FIND OUT THE TERRIBLE THINGS HE DID.

LOOK INTO THEIR OIL BUSINESSES THEY DID BUSINESS WITH OSAMA BIN LADENS FAMILY.

BUSH INTRODUCED OPERATION
IRAQI
LIBERATION
IN 2003 WHICH SPELLS OUT OIL.

OUR GOVERNMENT HAS BEEN INFILTRATED BY A SECRET ORGANIZATION.

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: holy fuck ()
Date: January 27, 2012 02:21PM

Just one thing if jet fuel will melt steel and titanium then wtf are jet engines made of. And 911 was in fact a conspiracy it is the very definition of a conspiracy. A conspiracy is when 2 or more people get together and plan to do something.... just a couple idle thoughts I got on my mind.@

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: DavidB ()
Date: February 01, 2012 05:25AM

I love you Jane...

Let's leave these left wing loons to argue over what the meaning of is is and go grab an ice cream.


David

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Re: Reply to people who say jet fuel can't melt steel
Posted by: greg ()
Date: February 07, 2012 03:40PM

Fair enough Now what are the odds of all four beams failing simultaneously bringing the structure straight down? TWICE?

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